Author Topic: The Atari Panther  (Read 15801 times)

Offline Gorf

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #60 on: June 30, 2013, 21:25:40 PM »
Quote from: "The Laird"
Quote from: "Gorf"
Quote from: "The Laird"
Quote from: "Gorf"
Besides, with the right dev tools all those games from the ST. Amiga days could have been easily ported over to the Jaguar given its 68k and several were as a matterof fact... a lot of good that did for it as we now know today.

In my other post where I mention the games that should have been released with or shortly after the system
are the kind of projects Jaguar needed and many of them...that path was the right path, just too little to late.


Yes but Panther would have been 2 years before Jaguar when those were the games that people wanted and they were not yet old hat.

If that were the case then the CD32 should have been successful...it was released in the same year.

It was though, Commodore sold an impressive 100,000 units alone in the UK in the short time it was on the market, it never even got a worldwide release because of the company going bust shortly afterwards.

100k units is really not that impressive especially to developers. It would have failed at the time because it could not even keep up with 3DO and Jaguar hardware wise. Ports may have lured a few Amiga/ST folks but it would have done nothing for the wider fan bases of Nintendo and Sega.

Offline TL

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #61 on: June 30, 2013, 21:27:20 PM »
100k in just a few months in one country is, hence why the CD32 was really well supported - even if they were just ports. But understandable when it was just a consolised A1200 anyway.

Offline Gorf

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #62 on: June 30, 2013, 21:33:21 PM »
Quote from: "The Laird"
100k in just a few months in one country is, hence why the CD32 was really well supported - even if they were just ports. But understandable when it was just a consolised A1200 anyway.


My point exactly ...it was probably mostly Amiga/ST enthusiasts. Computer to console releases have never been very successful. XEGS is a good example of this. Why buy a stripped down keyboardless version of a computer
to play games when you already have one or can get the full computer. The Atari 8 bit machines at the time were
not to far off the price of the XEGS as it was.

Offline Rogue Trooper

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #63 on: June 30, 2013, 21:37:11 PM »
Quote from: "The Laird"
*SIGH*  :46:

I will reply again.

7800 controllers were designed before the Tramiels came along anyway, Warner were happy to throw money away.

The Jaguar controller port has more pins so you need the adaptor to plug in a ST mouse. There are a number of homebrew games that use it.

Virgin developed, but didn't release, Demolition Man for the Jaguar CD (there is a prototype out there) which was specifically developed for the Jaguar and 3DO. They were also set to release Creature Shock (finished and lost) and a special version of Earthworm Jim.

Jaguar Theme Park (By Ocean) has more rides/amusements than the other console versions and Ocean also had the brilliant Apeshit/Toki Goes Apespit, which was a Jaguar exclusive that was previewed in Edge and reportedly finished. Not to mention other games they were developing with Jaguar in mind like TFX, Water World and Lobo.

Like i said (not going to go for a SIGH though...) i could'nt recal theJaguar ports, but it seemed odd you could'nt just plug in an ATARI mouse as machine was according to Atari designed as Multi-Media device.

Doubt if any buisness would be happy to throw money away, but if we are talking differing policies between owners of the company, then that changes things slightly as you were describing ATARI, not ATARI under ownership of...


Exactly, Virgin with demolition man had cross-development set up, easy to port from 3Do to Jaguar and vice versa, not the same risk as developing a game exclusively for a platform, Virgin with Creature shock? still got interview with Jez San where he talks about that, designed as a PC CD game when ' CD-ROMs were just a possibility for PC' and there were possibilities for: 3DO,  FM Towns, CD-i 2 and just about any CD console' were his words, so again, cross-platform, easy to port stuff.

The S.E version of EWJ, pray tell would it have been the MCD game which had extra level etc? but in more colours? i'd reckon it was given how the SNES version of EWJ appeared ported on PS1.

Ocean as i said (sigh :-) ), wanted Jaguar to do well and so put more into it, TFX would have been Amiga/Pc port, something which was tried on PS1 but aborted as they just could'nt get game running anywhere near fast enough, so i wonder how Jaguar version would have fared? as EDGE themselves said, Jaguar hardware seemed ideally suited as game used plain polygons.Lobo i seem to recal was cross platform, as was Waterworld, which i last saw in Playstation Plus magazine.

Offline AmigaJay

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #64 on: June 30, 2013, 21:53:28 PM »
Quote from: "Gorf"

100k units is really not that impressive especially to developers. It would have failed at the time because it could not even keep up with 3DO and Jaguar hardware wise. Ports may have lured a few Amiga/ST folks but it would have done nothing for the wider fan bases of Nintendo and Sega.
Bit harsh, the reason the CD32 failed was because Commodore US not paying debts, had its stock of CD32s ready for the US launch seized and forced Commodore International into filing for bankruptcy, had it not obviously more momentum and more games would have been released, so I think 100k and 160 games for a machine on the market 6 months wasn't bad at a time when the market was over saturated with machines anyway.
Plus you mention its not impressive for developers....at the time software wise the CD32 outsold the CDi, Mega-CD and PC-CD sales COMBINED! But anyway, no it's sales were never gonna be like Sega or Nintendos anyway, heck the Master System alone outsold the entire Amiga range!
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Offline Gorf

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #65 on: June 30, 2013, 22:35:16 PM »
Not trying to be harsh but we've seen this before and it would have been the same reason Panther failed and part of the reason Jaguar failed.

Offline AmigaJay

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #66 on: June 30, 2013, 22:47:26 PM »
Quote from: "Gorf"
Not trying to be harsh but we've seen this before and it would have been the same reason Panther failed and part of the reason Jaguar failed.
Trouble is people think just because its a console it's automatically competing with Sega and Nintendo, when in fact the CD32 was carving its own market based obviously on the back of the Amiga's success, to say it wouldn't have succeeded is a little short-sighted esp given it didn't get a chance to succeed, and I hate the fact that people tend to think if a console doesn't sell 20 million+ it's deemed a failure....the success of a console from a consumer pov is the amount of decent games a console gets not the sales figures.
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Offline Rogue Trooper

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #67 on: June 30, 2013, 22:58:54 PM »
Quote from: "AmigaJay"
Quote from: "Gorf"
Not trying to be harsh but we've seen this before and it would have been the same reason Panther failed and part of the reason Jaguar failed.
Trouble is people think just because its a console it's automatically competing with Sega and Nintendo, when in fact the CD32 was carving its own market based obviously on the back of the Amiga's success, to say it wouldn't have succeeded is a little short-sighted esp given it didn't get a chance to succeed, and I hate the fact that people tend to think if a console doesn't sell 20 million+ it's deemed a failure....the success of a console from a consumer pov is the amount of decent games a console gets not the sales figures.

Think media (and sadly a lot of forum posters, not here thank god) love to describe things in very simple terms, device A was a hit, device B which sold X-thousand less was a failure, (and it's games were shit etc etc).PSP deemed a failure next to DS, Saturn a failure next to PS1, yet would anyone say the original Xbox was a failure or 360? both bombed in Japan.The PC Engine? never even released over here, the N64 is classed as a failure next to PS1 also.

The MCD is deemed a failure, based on sales, but i wonder which had more games written for the hardware, MCD or CD32? and which had the more big name support?.

Opens up entire new wave of discussion as 1 might have 'failed' to attract big name developers, but got sales the competing format, which did have the big guns on board, could only dream of.

Failure people is not an option :-)


Seriousily though, it's all subjective, i was given a GB, which hardly a failure, sales wise, yet it'll always be a failure to me, as i hate the damn thing, screen is awful.so i've never collected for it, so it's failed to entertain me, thus failed from a design point of view, a gaming device i do not game on....

Offline AmigaJay

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #68 on: June 30, 2013, 23:32:10 PM »
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"

The MCD is deemed a failure, based on sales, but i wonder which had more games written for the hardware, MCD or CD32? and which had the more big name support?.

Obviously the Mega CD had the bigger name support as when Commodore went bankrupt they jumped ship, so 6 months of sales wasnt gonna entice big publishers to a platform gaining no new buyers.
Games wise the CD32 got 150 within 2 years, the Mega CD got 220 during its 5 year life, both platforms had loads of ports, but I never saw that as a problem, I'd rather have the best version with cd music, speech, no disk swapping etc!
Anyway best stop, The Laird will cut me knackers off for hijacking the thread soz!
Old School Gamer Since 1982 - Creator of various gaming websites and blogs 1998-2018

Offline TL

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #69 on: June 30, 2013, 23:38:39 PM »
Nah you are cool Jay  :113:

Offline DreamcastRIP

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #70 on: July 01, 2013, 10:49:50 AM »
Has the recent outbreak of sighing stopped yet?  :4:
Owned: Spectrum Jaguar JaguarCD Lynx ST 7800 Dreamcast Saturn MegaDrive Mega-CD 32X Nomad GameGear PS3 PS PSP WiiU Wii GameCube N64 DS, GBm GBA GBC GBP GB VirtualBoy Xbox Vectrex PCE Duo-R 3DO CDi CD32 GX4000 WonderSwan NGPC Gizmondo ColecoVision iPhone PC Mac

Offline Rogue Trooper

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #71 on: July 01, 2013, 11:46:54 AM »
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
Has the recent outbreak of sighing stopped yet?  :4:
:-) Just let me get a 2nd wind.....

Offline DreamcastRIP

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #72 on: July 01, 2013, 11:58:40 AM »
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
:-) Just let me get a 2nd wind.....

Owned: Spectrum Jaguar JaguarCD Lynx ST 7800 Dreamcast Saturn MegaDrive Mega-CD 32X Nomad GameGear PS3 PS PSP WiiU Wii GameCube N64 DS, GBm GBA GBC GBP GB VirtualBoy Xbox Vectrex PCE Duo-R 3DO CDi CD32 GX4000 WonderSwan NGPC Gizmondo ColecoVision iPhone PC Mac

Offline Rogue Trooper

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #73 on: July 01, 2013, 12:04:26 PM »
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
:-) Just let me get a 2nd wind.....



Sigh Hard II:Sigh Harder, coming soon to a Retro Forum near you.

Offline DreamcastRIP

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Re: The Atari Panther
« Reply #74 on: July 01, 2013, 12:30:47 PM »
Joking aside, such passionate debate as there has been in this thread should be encouraged here, if anything. Thank heavens this place isn't like certain other forums where spirited debate gets confused with argument by the intellectually challenged and where threads are locked as a result. No insults were bandied about, no snide comments were made * and no forum rules were broken. All's good.




* apart from me having branded Laird an Atari fanboy but that's just plain fact, not an insult!  :24:
Owned: Spectrum Jaguar JaguarCD Lynx ST 7800 Dreamcast Saturn MegaDrive Mega-CD 32X Nomad GameGear PS3 PS PSP WiiU Wii GameCube N64 DS, GBm GBA GBC GBP GB VirtualBoy Xbox Vectrex PCE Duo-R 3DO CDi CD32 GX4000 WonderSwan NGPC Gizmondo ColecoVision iPhone PC Mac

 

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