The NES and the UK - What really happened?

[DreamcastRIP]

Well, having looked at how various multi-format magazines in UK rated the arcade conversions to NES along with these 'classic' NES games Nintendo can be seen to be raving about these day's along with it's partners, i've just found a N.M.S 'Game Index', so lets see how a Nintendo specific magazine rated some familar names:


Hogans Alley 60%
Ikari warriors 48%
Kid Icarus 68%
Iron Sword 77%
Mach Rider 36%
Metal Gear 52%
Metriod 80%
Paperboy 30%
Rainbow Islands 67%
Road Blasters 48%
Wizards And warriors 72%
Xevious 65%

So come on Nintendo and 'partners' you really, honest to god, just have to stop these claims about how NES games were regarded in UK as even Nintendo specific magazines did not rate them anywhere near your claims.your just making yourselves out to be utter fools here, it's bad enough seeing the old New From Nintendo 1 page ads, advertising the latest NES releases in old copies of say Mean Machines, with slogan: Nintendo (i.e NES) The worlds Number 1 game system-Parts of the world, yes, but over here? hell no.

Excellent finds there, RT.

So even Nintendo Magazine System magazine thought numerous, ahem, 'NES classics' to range from woeful to mediocre with only Metroid having scraped a review score 80% or above from the list provided.

Don't forget that RG magazine Nintendo evangelist Paul Davies is a former editor of that Nintendo Magazine System as it states proudly on his column's page each month. I say 'Nintendo evangelist' on account of him finding it impossible most months to not big up Nintendo in his column or plug a current-gen game by Nintendo there even though it's allegedly a retro gaming publication. This is the guy who also stated in his column that the ZX Spectrum's finest achievement was to 'pave the way' for Nintendo's NES, lest we forget.

[Rogue Trooper]

LOL, probably guilty of having too much time on my hands, but i'd rather be guilty as charged there than openly spreading the myth of just how well the NES and it's games were recived in the UK, which so much of todays media seems happy to do.

What adverts and articles describe as all time classics, highly regarded, outstanding conversions, groundbreaking etc clearly were not seen as such by UK press, from multi-formats to Nintendo specific magazines, other formats had earlier, superior versions of the same arcade games and they were far cheaper and the NES exclusives did not have the impact they are proclaimed to have made.


Now given this information is so freely avaiable online with sites like here posting up review scans and scores from magazines of old, just who are they trying to fool and do they think the readership ignorant or what?.If you claim in a feature or advert that a game was highly rated at time of release, then show us the scores it achived, if you say it or a publication was a 'best seller' then print the sales figures, other magazines, games happy to do so and if you don't? it's clear it's smoke and mirrors crap.

People are no longer restricted to reading just what the advertisers or magazine article wants them to believe, information is only a mere goggle search away, yet still the claims go on.

[Rogue Trooper]

Right, asked for circulation figures to compare todays best selling with mags from say 16 Bit Console era, best i've found so far is EDGE advert claiming to have 150, 270 regular readers a month.Interesting they say regular readers, not EDGE shifts/sells 150, 270 a month.

If 1 person lends his copy out to mates or there's a copy sat on a waiting room table or people pick up and glance through at newstand, you've gained 'readers', but why won't publishers give actual sales figures these days?

[Rogue Trooper]

From EDGE  Issue 124, article 'Public Revelations' where EDGE looks into the realationship between P.R people and the gaming press:

'we heard that Nintendo was going to have a big launch for the GBA SP-But not from them.when we called to enquire they admitted it was going on, but said the event was not for the specialist press-as far as we could make out, it was crap celebrities who used to be on Eastenders and tabloid jurnos all piling into a bash with booze, complimentary SP's, dinner and no specialist press.One of us was in the area and even tried to talk his way in, but failed.soon after, the specialist press was sent a release retrospectively aleting them to the launch and asking them to cover the celbrity-studded event in their magazines and websites.How we laughed' Anon

IF P.R dept at Nintendo were 'happy' to resort to tactics like that, no wonder i'm reading revised versions of history of NES in UK. if games jurnolists are considered a lower priority than tabloid jurnos then it's clear they must be happy to get the scraps from the table, lol.

[onthinice]

Seems Nintendo was holding a grudge over past coverage of their systems. Are newspapers, magazines and tabloids still as big in the UK as they once were?

[TL]

Just found this in my scans from The One:

[onthinice]

Never tried the cereal. Wonder if it was any good? Almost missed that snippet about the Lynx. Nice scans!!!!

[DreamcastRIP]

An interesting quote in that article about Nintendo's "'failure to generate sufficient enthusiasm here" with their hyping of the NES. The magazine even seems to express doubt about Nintendo's (then) future hopes of commercial success in the UK such was the lack of enthusiasm here for it.

[Rogue Trooper]

From Edge p2 of a feature on Emulators (this from good few years back)

'...NES game libary is loaded with timeless, glorious, seminal gems in exactly the same way that the MS libary is'nt'

Hmmmn....

Anywho, feature does point out that European NES owners were denied some of the finest NES had to offer such as Jackal, Mag Max and Tiger Heli-Never played any of those.any good on NES?

[TL]

From Edge p2 of a feature on Emulators (this from good few years back)

'...NES game libary is loaded with timeless, glorious, seminal gems in exactly the same way that the MS libary is'nt'

Hmmmn....

Anywho, feature does point out that European NES owners were denied some of the finest NES had to offer such as Jackal, Mag Max and Tiger Heli-Never played any of those.any good on NES?

WTF?! 

So they are trying to say that games like OutRun, Afterburner, Sonic The Hedgehog, Double Dragon, Alex Kidd (any of them), Chase HQ, Operation Wolf, Columns, Street Fighter II, Space Harrier, Golden Axe, Shinobi, Choplifter, Renegade, Phantasy Star and Dynamite Heddy are not classic games. Yeah ok Edge . . . . . . . .

[Rogue Trooper]

From Edge p2 of a feature on Emulators (this from good few years back)

'...NES game libary is loaded with timeless, glorious, seminal gems in exactly the same way that the MS libary is'nt'

Hmmmn....

Anywho, feature does point out that European NES owners were denied some of the finest NES had to offer such as Jackal, Mag Max and Tiger Heli-Never played any of those.any good on NES?

WTF?! 

So they are trying to say that games like OutRun, Afterburner, Sonic The Hedgehog, Double Dragon, Alex Kidd (any of them), Chase HQ, Operation Wolf, Columns, Street Fighter II, Space Harrier, Golden Axe, Shinobi, Choplifter, Renegade, Phantasy Star and Dynamite Heddy are not classic games. Yeah ok Edge . . . . . . . .

Yep.I could'nt quite believe what i was reading either.

[Rogue Trooper]

Well, word just hit, apparently in 'grand scheme of things' UK means nothing, on a global scale in terms of the NES.

Coming from a publication that in past has been very 'eager' to claim just how popular it was over here (it was'nt) and how much of an impact a UK developer had on it's range of games (Rare) in terms of quality and innovation, i feel a Monty Python moment coming on...



www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExWfh6sGyso 

Each to their own and all that, but question has to be asked:

If it's a UK publication trying to appease or appeal to the 'global' market, the Speccy coverage or cult UK games with a very British sense of humour, is going to go wayyy over the heads of the rest of the world (things like:wanted Monty mole being based around UK Coal strikes), so pointless putting so much UK based coverage of games/any hardware platforms in, if they had such a limited impact in this 'Grand scheme Of Things', but it would explain the re-engineered history of the NES in UK....

Basically, we need sales figures here.Those for UK, those for rest of the world, who's are up, who's are down and just who the percived target market is.Otherwise publications like Retrogamer, Edge, Gamestm are just going to continue to appear as lacking direction and facts and the UK userbase alone going to start thinking:you know what? this is a mess, not worth my time and money.There's no focus any more.

[DreamcastRIP]

Well, word just hit, apparently in 'grand scheme of things' UK means nothing, on a global scale in terms of the NES.

Coming from a publication that in past has been very 'eager' to claim just how popular it was over here (it was'nt) and how much of an impact a UK developer had on it's range of games (Rare) in terms of quality and innovation, i feel a Monty Python moment coming on...



www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExWfh6sGyso

Oh dear, oh dear! From all I'm hearing it does seem as though the publication in question has dropped yet another clanger in relation to the NES this month. I've been told that the article in question was written by the very person who penned the infamous 'NES Collector's Guide' and equally poor 'Mega Drive Collector's Guide' of past issues so colour me unsurprised that this latest effort is already attracting much criticism. In fairness though, it seems to be the poor choice of associated wording present on the front cover that's come in for most criticism thus far.

... the UK userbase alone going to start thinking:you know what? this is a mess, not worth my time and money

I recently cancelled my subscription to Retro Gamer magazine largely as a consequence of its poor quality so hearing of this latest faux pas I feel reassured that I made the right decision. I may have a look at the article in question next time I'm in a WH Smith to see with my own eyes what all the commotion is about and brace myself for much rolling of the eyes, lol!

As for the attitude of the publication's editor to the feedback of paying customers, well, I don't think such a thing comes as any surprise. I won't comment on that matter any further though because we certainly don't want this very fine thread being derailed by talk of the likes of him.

[DreamcastRIP]

Quoting the relevant part to this topic from a post of RT's elsewhere on the forum in the Retro Gamer issue 118 thread,

Nes A celebration.Should'nt that read: Yet another celebration and if your from UK, you might as well not read as it won't reflect your version of history?.

Oh dear, oh dear. Will it never end?  " title="Roll Eyes" />

Firstly, the '30 years of NES' is factually incorrect from the get-go because the thirtieth anniversay of NES will be in February 2016... or October 2015 if one classes the limited test marketing launch of NES in New York City during late 1985 as the launch date. Referencing the launch of Famicom to somehow equate with the same thing as the launch of NES is misguided and only serves to rank Retro Gamer magazine alongside the websites that are currently doing the same thing as a desperate headline-grabbing attempt to pull in the punters.

From the wording of your post it seems RG think its core readership (that'll be in the UK then) are to join them in 'celebrating',

* the thirtieth anniversary of a Japan-only console (Famicom), or
(no problem with that per se but I expect the article is mostly about the NES, not the Famicom)

* the thirtieth anniversary of a console that was released in late 1985 (or early 1986 for the full launch), or
(meaning the magazine is therefore celebrating over two years too early)

* the thirtieth anniversary of a console that was released in Europe in September 1986
(meaning the magazine is therefore celebrating over three years too early)

Also, the NES was a commercial failure in the UK despite Nintendo's repeated attempts to try making it succeed. So why does this magazine with a majority UK readership deem that those in the UK would wish to 'celebrate' the anniversary of a product that bearly anyone here gave a damn about? That doesn't make sense, surely? By all means have it featured in the magazine's 'Minority Report' pages as another failed obscure retro console but it doesn't make sense to 'celebrate' a product that was so unpopular.

So now that's the flawed premise of the article dealt with, onto other matters...

I say that as early line: 'For many players it represents their 1st ever taste of videogaming'-sigh, it's like the arcades, ZX81, 2600, Game and Watch, countless LCD hand helds, Speccy, C64, Amstra, entire A8 Micro range, MS, schools having the BBC Micro etc etc never happened, ever (and here's a mere footnote on how it struggled in Europe).

That specific quotation you've referenced (highlighted in red by myself) there should trouble any free-thinking person who actually gives a damn for history being recounted in a fair and accurate manner.

The publication in question has past form in this regard (RG issue 101, see earlier in thread) and its editor is on record as saying "I... pride myself on the magazine's accuracy". I shall leave it to those reading this to decide for themselves what to make of such instances.

Yet again we have a UK-based media source referring to the NES as though it was once was the gaming system of choice worldwide when anyone with a knowledge of the facts knows it was no such thing.

Why not instead say 'For many US gamers the NES represents their first ever taste of videogaming'?
Is it really so difficult to say that or did the publication once more let a Nintendo fanboy pen another Nintendo-related article and not bother to proof read it before committing it to be published? The way the article has worded it is to imply the NES was an unqualified global success... which is not only incorrect but it also perhaps has the appearance of being disingenuous when viewed in the context of claims made in past issues of said publication.

If the blunder was a one-off then perhaps it could be dismissed as having been a genuine mistake but this is not a one-off. The magazine in question wilfully continuing to present NES the way it does (and as frequently as it does), when it supposedly 'prides itself on its accuracy' seems most peculiar to me. One could be forgiven for wondering if there's an agenda being served...

[Rogue Trooper]

I'm really starting to question just what's going on at RG towers here....the magazine head and indeed publisher website are happy to tell me they take pride in the articles they produce, that they are well written, factual and i won't find the likes of them anywhere else, yet this 'celebrational piece' on the NES, is as DC rightly points out, anything but factual, as timing is years out, is yet another 'NES:How it saved the industry' type piece which to me is not written for the UK market as it applies a thick layer of 'gloss-over' paint to fact that for so many of the UK gamers, we are left scratching our heads, not celbrating the NES, as it was not our 1st gaming experience, far from it and many of us only ventured onto it in order to try and work out why it gets so much coverage.

I was playing a lot of Nintendo Game And Watch games, as were my friends (and how i wish i'd kept them) for years, so personally i'd be looking to celbrate them for the impact they had, so many of us had them, yet the NES? not even a drop in our gaming ocean.

The European failure of the NES, whilst mentioned, only saw a few lines, Castlevania was'nt even a NES only series, MSX had it in terms of Vampire Hunter, Bionic Commando saw release on European 8 Bit micros, Wizzards and Warriors never hit it big with UK press, let alone gamers and no mention of fact that Nintendo tried twice to conquer Europe? the piece reads as if Nintendo was'nt that interested in European market, yet as we've mentioned in this thread and others it clearly was other wise it would'nt of had 2 cracks at the market.No mention that it was 1st given to Mattel to handle...and this is supoosed to be a factual piece?


I too am left wondering just why RG magazine constantly produces NES articles in way it does, time and time again page after page devoted to USA and Japan side of the NES, no mention of how UK press scored NES games, choice of 3 covers, 2 of which were NES related.

Yes i've seen poorly done pieces on the NES in Gamestm+EDGE, mentioned them before on here, but RG..man alive, it's just drowning in NES alt.history and is honestly openly insulting to UK readership-The people behind issue 118 cannot say ohh we were limited in space, hence the footnote on Europe or we wanted to mention...but could'nt UK Press ratings for games (something they've been coy about in each and every NES article i've read).

Surely an editor looking for new goals could do a flipside feature on the NES, how it was recived in UK, by gamers and Press, hell aim it at your US readership, say you might be surprised to read this but, here's how UK press viewed games you guys love, it'd be the new slant on old subject the Editor claims so often you'll only find in RG, if not that at very least find some new people to interview, great as they are, it's same coders popping up in the magazine time and time agaign, Ste Pickford, great coder and joy to read, but how many times have i read interview with him on various hardware now? (plus sorry Ste, but Nes games were fast and responsive? you've clearly never played Joe And Mac on NEs for starters!!!!!).

For the love of god RG, if your going to do another NES piece anytime soon (and given track history...) at least get someone to do it who can present it as balanced, factual and offer a fresh view on a tired and worn subject and bloody hell, branch out from your pool of 'coders still willing to talk to us'.It's laughable to see the claims made for RG:

Best selling:The publisher has never released actual figures and anytime anyone has posted figures for an issue on RG forum, ed pops up saying:Your way off the mark, it sold much better.Did it? well back up that claim then...just how many did it sell? Nintendo covers sell like 'Gang Busters'-right, step back, just WTF does that mean, don't give me slang terms, what are the figures?Live publishing were happy enpough to give figures for RG when it was under their wing, which current RG editor went on record to dispute at 1 point saying the claimed 20,000 sales for 1 specific issue was a 'bizzare rumour', yet Lives own figures showed it was a 20,000 print run which all copies were sold.

One minute the editor says 'A magazine like RG is always going to be mega niche' and ....'As long as it remains profitable to make, the magazine will continue', next it's a 'best seller' and depending on cover, it sells like a 'gangbuster'.

Does it feature NES articles you won't find elsewhere? does it hell, i still recal the Zelda feature it did with 'Zelda:Family Tree' part coming straight from Gamestm, ohh sorry, 'borrowed' from Gamestm....

Mind you that was'nt as sad as seeing it's 'History Of GTA' feature turning up on a free booklet on front of PLAY magazine months later.

So no, you will find it's features, interviews, you name it, in other publications and online, you'll just be hard pressed to find so much NES coverage, so often elsewhere appears to be more truthful line.