Retro Video Gamer

Welcome to Retro Video Gamer => Retro News & Chat => Topic started by: Bobinator on August 03, 2013, 00:36:12 AM

Title: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Bobinator on August 03, 2013, 00:36:12 AM
Gaming's changed a lot lately, as I'm sure you all know. And I'm sure you can all agree it hasn't always been for the better. So what I'm asking is, what parts of classic gaming do you miss that you just don't see anymore? Here's mine:

1. Boss fights. I really, really love boss fights, if they're done well. Sometimes they can be the highlight of a game, sometimes theyy can make up the big majority of a game. I could think of a million good examples. Problem is, lately apparently they're too "video gamey" for a modern "cinematic experience", so when they DO happen, they tend to be incredibly short and easy. Or they're just one big QTE. I don't care if they're "video gamey", they're fun and I miss them.

The exceptions: Sonic Generations, any game by Platinum (Bayonetta, Metal Gear Rising), Batman: Arkham City

2. Cheat codes. I'm not JUST talking the standard 'invicibility/level select/what have you' codes, here, I'm fine with cosmetic stuff like big head mode. But that would ruin the challenge of getting all them cheevos, so here we are. And when they ARE in, the game makes you pay for them, like The Godfather on the 360.

The exceptions: Batman Arkham City has a big head cheat code. This pleases me. The Saint's Row games also have a ton of cheats.

3. Split screen multiplayer. Playing with your friends is fun, even when it's on a tiny corner of the screen you can barely see. But, alas, if you play it that way, you can't make your friends buy three other copies of the game, so have fun forcing your friends to stay home while you play with them.

The exceptions: Sonic & Sega All-Star Racing. There are probably more, but I can't think of them.

4. Platformers. I am a FIEND for platformers, I'll have you know. Sadly, in this era of desert shooty times, I've been rather starved. Things have been slowly looking up, but there's not exactly a plethora of options. And no, I'm not counting all of those really hard one-hit kill platformers that slather spikes all over the place, like Super Meat Boy.

The exceptions: Sonic, Rayman, Mario.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrapZZ on August 03, 2013, 04:41:54 AM
Cool thread!

What I miss most is being thrown into a game with little instructions, no map, and having to use my head to figure it out.

With current games they throw you in and you get: A Forced tutorial, achievements for every little thing you do, a map or some other form of guidance that takes away from the "where the hell am I" feel.

I'm sure there are exceptions, but all this hand-holding of most modern games drives me crazy.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Bobinator on August 03, 2013, 04:43:37 AM
Quote from: "TrapZZ"
Cool thread!

What I miss most is being thrown into a game with little instructions, no map, and having to use my head to figure it out.

With current games they throw you in and you get: A Forced tutorial, achievements for every little thing you do, a map or some other form of guidance that takes away from the "where the hell am I" feel.

I'm sure there are exceptions, but all this hand-holding of most modern games drives me crazy.

You might enjoy Dark Souls. I could never get into it, but it's an action RPG that's very difficult, very unforgiving, and doesn't give you much real clue on what to do besides the basic controls and mechanics.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrapZZ on August 03, 2013, 05:10:42 AM
Neat, thanks for the recommendation.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Mire Mare on August 03, 2013, 09:49:46 AM
Loading screens and the music.  I can remember looking forward to seeing what amazing image the computer could display whilst it was busy loading a game and regularly being impressed with what my c64 could do.

I was going to add loading times as something I missed.  It was sometimes the only time for a few hours I would go and get something to eat and drink.  A bowl of Wotsits and fizzy pop would always go down well :)  But, since. Got a Wii U I've got time to make a brew while some games load.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 03, 2013, 11:15:33 AM
Brilliant idea for a thread!

Quote from: "Bobinator"
3. Split screen multiplayer. Playing with your friends is fun, even when it's on a tiny corner of the screen you can barely see. But, alas, if you play it that way, you can't make your friends buy three other copies of the game, so have fun forcing your friends to stay home while you play with them.

Definitely this one right here ^^^^

One of mine:

Scrolling Beat 'em ups - You rarely see this anymore and if you do they never seem to match the magnificence of games like the Streets Of Rage series, Final Fight, Ninja Gaiden or original Double Dragon. Stopping the SOR series was one of the biggest mistakes Sega ever made in my opinion and I am baffled why Capcom have never brought back Final Fight, would make a nice change from the seemingly endless Street Fighter games.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 03, 2013, 12:05:52 PM
One thing sorely lacking today on many systems is a vast selection of decent simple space games.
Yeah, you get one or two but most of them are anything but original.

I also miss the infinite game play...nowadays the games ends and its done. Very little replay value.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 03, 2013, 13:28:22 PM
The relative simplicity of using a joystick with ONE fire button.

Playing the likes of Kick Off 2 and Sensible Soccer on their original platforms meant using a controller with one fire button but, due to intelligent gameplay design, the controls were nuanced meaning that they took time to master.

Nowadays, playing the latest FIFA and PES games seems more like a memory test than an intuitive gameplay experience to me. Having to pause the game to consult the manual in order to find out which button does 'x' or, worse still, which combination of button presses does 'y' does not make for a fun game, imho.

I'm not suggesting that it'd be great if gaming returned to using joysticks with one fire button - I just miss the simplicity of using them when playing a number of games this past decade or so. It's partly for why I took to enjoying gaming on the Wii so immediately back in 2007 - playing the tennis mini-game of Wii Sports (where no buttons at all were required to be used... just like Pong!) felt like a welcome throwback to the days of old when gameplay design was more 'pure', for the want of a better term.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrekMD on August 03, 2013, 15:53:59 PM
I agree with DC, simple controls!  My preference would be for a joystick and TWO buttons.  That's it.  No need to have a PhD on control mechanisms before you can start playing a game. 
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: tomwaits on August 03, 2013, 17:17:02 PM
Simplify.

(http://www.sufficientlyadvancedrobots.com/wp-content/uploads/sfdx_01.jpg)
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrekMD on August 03, 2013, 17:18:08 PM
Quote from: "tomwaits"
Simplify.

(http://www.sufficientlyadvancedrobots.com/wp-content/uploads/sfdx_01.jpg)

Oversimplification!  :21:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Mire Mare on August 03, 2013, 17:21:18 PM
Are simple controls are a thing of the past? Controls have evolved, and become convoluted for some games, but there's an increased intuitive nature that has developed alongside the evolution of gaming. It could be argued that motion controls, are simpler than a joystick with one button.

Splitscreen multiplayer is alive and well in the current generation.

A lot of what we think is 'missing' probably isn't. The volume and variety of games, and hardware on which to play those games, certainly far outweighs my knowledge of the modern gaming picture. The mainstream simply clouds the view.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: 64bitRuss on August 03, 2013, 17:47:26 PM
Cartridges
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 03, 2013, 17:50:34 PM
Another one:

High Scores - I know that there are plenty of indie games and downloads out there that still rely on/feature high scores and high score tables but it seems that scores are not as important as they once were. There was a time when all games were about was getting the high score, nowadays a lot of games don't even have scores anymore!
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: tomwaits on August 03, 2013, 17:58:54 PM
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
A lot of what we think is 'missing' probably isn't. The volume and variety of games, and hardware on which to play those games, certainly far outweighs my knowledge of the modern gaming picture. The mainstream simply clouds the view.

Definitely agree. There are plenty of classic style games on all the modern platforms, they're just not the games that the mainstream audience is playing. You can class them as 'exceptions', but classic style/retro inspired/game-like gaming is the majority of my game libraries on the modern consoles.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Shadowrunner on August 03, 2013, 18:06:02 PM
Quote from: "TrapZZ"
Neat, thanks for the recommendation.

I'll second that Dark Souls recommendation. I'm playing it right now and getting close to the end. It's been an incredible adventure!!!

As for what I miss, I miss the days when anybody and everybody was either releasing a console or a add on for a console. Back in the early 90's there was always something new coming out and while many of them failed it was still a very exciting time.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 03, 2013, 20:52:07 PM
Quote from: "The Laird"
Another one:

High Scores - I know that there are plenty of indie games and downloads out there that still rely on/feature high scores and high score tables but it seems that scores are not as important as they once were. There was a time when all games were about was getting the high score, nowadays a lot of games don't even have scores anymore!

Trophies and Gamer score are sadly seen as the new High scores, but pale next to the importance of beating your mates highscores.Thank goodness plenty of PSN/XBLA games i've bought have online score tables.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 03, 2013, 20:55:00 PM
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
Loading screens and the music.  I can remember looking forward to seeing what amazing image the computer could display whilst it was busy loading a game and regularly being impressed with what my c64 could do.

I was going to add loading times as something I missed.  It was sometimes the only time for a few hours I would go and get something to eat and drink.  A bowl of Wotsits and fizzy pop would always go down well :)  But, since. Got a Wii U I've got time to make a brew while some games load.

We PS3 owners can often cook a small meal whilst waiting for MGS 4 to instal (least it does it all in 1 go now, but bloody hell!)
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 03, 2013, 21:00:16 PM
Quote from: "TrapZZ"
Cool thread!

What I miss most is being thrown into a game with little instructions, no map, and having to use my head to figure it out.

With current games they throw you in and you get: A Forced tutorial, achievements for every little thing you do, a map or some other form of guidance that takes away from the "where the hell am I" feel.

I'm sure there are exceptions, but all this hand-holding of most modern games drives me crazy.


Hacker was mentioned here the other day, now there was a gem on C64, just a screen with Login:

Sat there and i had no idea what to do, soon figured it out, but these days when game gives you a trophy or gamerscore for following a tutorial through to the end? forget it.


If your a PS3 owner Demon's and Dark souls are indeed the games for you.Ohh they'll hold your hand, but only once they've cut it clean off your wrist and you'll know it was your fault as you rushed in, did'nt prepare for the encounter etc.

Huge part of the 2 Soul's games for myself was just that aspect of venturing into the unknown, knowing death was a mere heartbeat away and you had but 1 chance to reclaim your lost souls once you died.Feck it up on way back-they are gone forever.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 03, 2013, 21:07:39 PM
Quote from: "TrekMD"
Quote from: "tomwaits"
Simplify.

(http://www.sufficientlyadvancedrobots.com/wp-content/uploads/sfdx_01.jpg)

Oversimplification!  :24:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 03, 2013, 21:15:11 PM
Quote from: "tomwaits"
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
A lot of what we think is 'missing' probably isn't. The volume and variety of games, and hardware on which to play those games, certainly far outweighs my knowledge of the modern gaming picture. The mainstream simply clouds the view.

Definitely agree. There are plenty of classic style games on all the modern platforms, they're just not the games that the mainstream audience is playing. You can class them as 'exceptions', but classic style/retro inspired/game-like gaming is the majority of my game libraries on the modern consoles.

I agree. Hence why in my post I avoided making a sweeping statement in reference to all games and instead referenced football games.

I'd love it if FIFA and PES had an extra mode, called something like 'arcade' mode maybe, where the controls were simplified. The game/s would, when playing that mode, be more easily accessible, i.e. more akin to an arcade-like experience. I'd enjoy having the choice.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Mire Mare on August 03, 2013, 21:27:10 PM
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "The Laird"
Another one:

High Scores - I know that there are plenty of indie games and downloads out there that still rely on/feature high scores and high score tables but it seems that scores are not as important as they once were. There was a time when all games were about was getting the high score, nowadays a lot of games don't even have scores anymore!

Trophies and Gamer score are sadly seen as the new High scores, but pale next to the importance of beating your mates highscores.Thank goodness plenty of PSN/XBLA games i've bought have online score tables.
Totally - online highscore tables are great.  I admit to having been very competitive on a number of XBLA games.  A - be the top of my friends highscore table and B - to be as high as possible in the overall rankings.  Purely for my own benefit (ego ;) ) of course. 

I don't have so much time to be able to spend hours honing skills and learning patterns or ways to increase scores any more.  I've been playing Renegade Ops on the 360, a great twin stick shooter, but I can't get near the top scores in my friend list!
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Mire Mare on August 03, 2013, 21:28:24 PM
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
Loading screens and the music.  I can remember looking forward to seeing what amazing image the computer could display whilst it was busy loading a game and regularly being impressed with what my c64 could do.

I was going to add loading times as something I missed.  It was sometimes the only time for a few hours I would go and get something to eat and drink.  A bowl of Wotsits and fizzy pop would always go down well :21: I have heard about the PS3 but I've not experienced owning one.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Mire Mare on August 03, 2013, 21:33:15 PM
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
Quote from: "tomwaits"
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
A lot of what we think is 'missing' probably isn't. The volume and variety of games, and hardware on which to play those games, certainly far outweighs my knowledge of the modern gaming picture. The mainstream simply clouds the view.

Definitely agree. There are plenty of classic style games on all the modern platforms, they're just not the games that the mainstream audience is playing. You can class them as 'exceptions', but classic style/retro inspired/game-like gaming is the majority of my game libraries on the modern consoles.

I agree. Hence why in my post I avoided making a sweeping statement in reference to all games and instead referenced football games.

I'd love it if FIFA and PES had an extra mode, called something like 'arcade' mode maybe, where the controls were simplified. The game/s would, when playing that mode, be more easily accessible, i.e. more akin to an arcade-like experience. I'd enjoy having the choice.
That wasn't a swipe DC just a generalisation I was thinking about after reading your post.  You sound defensive!

As for the latest footy games including 'Fifa Arcade' or 'One button' PES... .. . well, that would be epic and would make those games an instant buy for me. 

Similarly, I was delighted to learn that EA have included NHL94(93?) in the next NHL game so I'll be picking up NHL14 when it comes out and having a good ol' nostalgia fix.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Vyothric on August 03, 2013, 23:02:39 PM
Technically I don't miss anything because I only play old games.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 03, 2013, 23:19:17 PM
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
Gaming by the simple for the simple!  :24:

.....you forgot.....from the simple minded.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 03, 2013, 23:25:39 PM
Quote from: "Vyothric"
Technically I don't miss anything because I only play old games.

Great answer  :21:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 03, 2013, 23:29:49 PM
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
Quote from: "tomwaits"
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
A lot of what we think is 'missing' probably isn't. The volume and variety of games, and hardware on which to play those games, certainly far outweighs my knowledge of the modern gaming picture. The mainstream simply clouds the view.

Definitely agree. There are plenty of classic style games on all the modern platforms, they're just not the games that the mainstream audience is playing. You can class them as 'exceptions', but classic style/retro inspired/game-like gaming is the majority of my game libraries on the modern consoles.

I agree. Hence why in my post I avoided making a sweeping statement in reference to all games and instead referenced football games.

I'd love it if FIFA and PES had an extra mode, called something like 'arcade' mode maybe, where the controls were simplified. The game/s would, when playing that mode, be more easily accessible, i.e. more akin to an arcade-like experience. I'd enjoy having the choice.
That wasn't a swipe DC just a generalisation I was thinking about after reading your post.  You sound defensive!

As for the latest footy games including 'Fifa Arcade' or 'One button' PES... .. . well, that would be epic and would make those games an instant buy for me. 

Similarly, I was delighted to learn that EA have included NHL94(93?) in the next NHL game so I'll be picking up NHL14 when it comes out and having a good ol' nostalgia fix.

No worries, MM!

Fascinating news there re: EA's next NHL game. The last EA NHL game that I've played which I truly enjoyed was NHL Hockey '94 on the Mega-CD. If they add online multiplayer then I'll be sorely tempted to buy it.  :1:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Bobinator on August 03, 2013, 23:35:39 PM
And if you allow iPhone/Android games to be classified as modern gaming, 95% of the library are about getting scores. A lot of them are usually 'endless' style games, too.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 04, 2013, 00:06:43 AM
Quote from: "Bobinator"
And if you allow iPhone/Android games to be classified as modern gaming, 95% of the library are about getting scores. A lot of them are usually 'endless' style games, too.

Therein lies the hope for this new little square....at least from my point of view.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 04, 2013, 00:11:35 AM
Quote from: "Bobinator"
And if you allow iPhone/Android games to be classified as modern gaming, 95% of the library are about getting scores. A lot of them are usually 'endless' style games, too.

True enough, shame 95% of touch screen games are unplayable shit! :3:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 04, 2013, 02:23:10 AM
Quote from: "The Laird"
Quote from: "Bobinator"
And if you allow iPhone/Android games to be classified as modern gaming, 95% of the library are about getting scores. A lot of them are usually 'endless' style games, too.

True enough, shame 95% of touch screen games are unplayable shit! :3:

95%? You are being quite generous. I've yet to find one that is worth shit.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 04, 2013, 02:44:06 AM
Quote from: "The Laird"
Quote from: "Bobinator"
And if you allow iPhone/Android games to be classified as modern gaming, 95% of the library are about getting scores. A lot of them are usually 'endless' style games, too.

True enough, shame 95% of touch screen games are unplayable shit! :3:

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2747/4244271798_6a61d2b9ef.jpg)
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrekMD on August 04, 2013, 02:53:47 AM
Quote from: "DreamcastRIP"
Quote from: "The Laird"
Quote from: "Bobinator"
And if you allow iPhone/Android games to be classified as modern gaming, 95% of the library are about getting scores. A lot of them are usually 'endless' style games, too.

True enough, shame 95% of touch screen games are unplayable shit! :24:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 04, 2013, 02:54:11 AM
Ok....i'll correct that statement I made a post back...card games are fine with Touch screens....but that is about all I can think of.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrapZZ on August 04, 2013, 03:30:15 AM
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "TrapZZ"
Cool thread!

What I miss most is being thrown into a game with little instructions, no map, and having to use my head to figure it out.

With current games they throw you in and you get: A Forced tutorial, achievements for every little thing you do, a map or some other form of guidance that takes away from the "where the hell am I" feel.

I'm sure there are exceptions, but all this hand-holding of most modern games drives me crazy.


Hacker was mentioned here the other day, now there was a gem on C64, just a screen with Login:

Sat there and i had no idea what to do, soon figured it out, but these days when game gives you a trophy or gamerscore for following a tutorial through to the end? forget it.


If your a PS3 owner Demon's and Dark souls are indeed the games for you.Ohh they'll hold your hand, but only once they've cut it clean off your wrist and you'll know it was your fault as you rushed in, did'nt prepare for the encounter etc.

Huge part of the 2 Soul's games for myself was just that aspect of venturing into the unknown, knowing death was a mere heartbeat away and you had but 1 chance to reclaim your lost souls once you died.Feck it up on way back-they are gone forever.

Yes!  I was the one that posted the Hacker screenshot :)  (At least I'm consistent with my likes!)  I'll definitely have to check out Dark Souls after all these recommendations.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 04, 2013, 11:41:28 AM
Another thing I miss is beautiful hand drawn art work:

(http://flyers.arcade-museum.com/flyers_video/atari/11019301.jpg)

Well maybe not all of it . . . . . .

(http://retrogamer.net/users/345/thm450/dragontrek.jpg)
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Mire Mare on August 04, 2013, 13:35:42 PM
:113:
Quote from: "Gorf"
Ok....i'll correct that statement I made a post back...card games are fine with Touch screens....but that is about all I can think of.
Not a fan of point & click adventure games, Gorf?. Simon the Sorcerer, Broken Sword, Year Walk, Genini Rue, Monkey Island?  Touch screens are the most 'natural' environment for these games.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrekMD on August 04, 2013, 14:49:50 PM
Quote from: "The Laird"
Well maybe not all of it . . . . . .

(http://retrogamer.net/users/345/thm450/dragontrek.jpg)

 :24:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 04, 2013, 19:12:25 PM
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
Loading screens and the music.  I can remember looking forward to seeing what amazing image the computer could display whilst it was busy loading a game and regularly being impressed with what my c64 could do.

I was going to add loading times as something I missed.  It was sometimes the only time for a few hours I would go and get something to eat and drink.  A bowl of Wotsits and fizzy pop would always go down well :21: I have heard about the PS3 but I've not experienced owning one.

MGS 4 was 1 of the early PS3 instal games and by god the worst, just so Hideo can indulge his failed film maker wank fest ideas.Cutscenes within cutscenes with thier own cut scenes? hell no!.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 04, 2013, 19:23:20 PM
Quote from: "Mire Mare"
:113:
Quote from: "Gorf"
Ok....i'll correct that statement I made a post back...card games are fine with Touch screens....but that is about all I can think of.
Not a fan of point & click adventure games, Gorf?. Simon the Sorcerer, Broken Sword, Year Walk, Genini Rue, Monkey Island?  Touch screens are the most 'natural' environment for these games.

I'm sure they may be but as you guessed, not at all a fan. Games should be fun...these types of games require
way too much cogitation .... I do plenty of that when coding and at work and when I want to chill, mindless shooters
are the way to go for me.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 04, 2013, 19:24:45 PM
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
MGS 4 was 1 of the early PS3 instal games and by god the worst, just so Hideo can indulge his failed film maker wank fest ideas.Cutscenes within cutscenes with thier own cut scenes? hell no!.

LOL! I concur whole heartedly.  :4:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Bobinator on August 04, 2013, 20:29:57 PM
Quote from: "The Laird"
(http://retrogamer.net/users/345/thm450/dragontrek.jpg)

OK, I can't NOT look at that and not imagine the guy going "BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUH" at the top of his lungs.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 04, 2013, 20:33:07 PM
Believe it or not there is a slight variation of that cover that looks even more camp!!!!

(http://www.jammajup.co.uk/dragon-32/dragon-trek.gif)
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Crusto on August 04, 2013, 22:44:39 PM
Quote from: "TrapZZ"
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Quote from: "TrapZZ"
Cool thread!

What I miss most is being thrown into a game with little instructions, no map, and having to use my head to figure it out.

With current games they throw you in and you get: A Forced tutorial, achievements for every little thing you do, a map or some other form of guidance that takes away from the "where the hell am I" feel.

I'm sure there are exceptions, but all this hand-holding of most modern games drives me crazy.


Hacker was mentioned here the other day, now there was a gem on C64, just a screen with Login:

Sat there and i had no idea what to do, soon figured it out, but these days when game gives you a trophy or gamerscore for following a tutorial through to the end? forget it.


If your a PS3 owner Demon's and Dark souls are indeed the games for you.Ohh they'll hold your hand, but only once they've cut it clean off your wrist and you'll know it was your fault as you rushed in, did'nt prepare for the encounter etc.

Huge part of the 2 Soul's games for myself was just that aspect of venturing into the unknown, knowing death was a mere heartbeat away and you had but 1 chance to reclaim your lost souls once you died.Feck it up on way back-they are gone forever.

Yes!  I was the one that posted the Hacker screenshot :)  (At least I'm consistent with my likes!)  I'll definitely have to check out Dark Souls after all these recommendations.

Yes, do so at once! That and Demons Souls are both fantastic titles that pose a real challenge, the risk/reward factor is excellent. And the online element is unique. You can't go wrong imo.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: onthinice on August 10, 2013, 13:42:17 PM
Three lives! Unless you are playing the Odyssey 2. The ability to re-spawn in games is so over the top and leaves little challenge to truly improve your gameplay.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 10, 2013, 21:25:34 PM
Great point that actually, I hate the way nearly all games have tutorials these days too - especially ones you cannot skip  :14:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 11, 2013, 21:51:38 PM
Mindless shooters rule!
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 14, 2013, 08:18:03 AM
As if right on cue here's a video trailer for the upcoming latest PES game to illustrate the aforementioned example of football games in the modern age.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDCXlyCo8L0#at=56 (http://http)

Firstly, the fact footy games even need a 'Tutorial' video speaks volumes about what it is to play them nowadays.

Secondly, that this is only Tutorial video # 01!

Just look at it! As I commented earlier in the thread to play these modern footy games well the player needs to memorise a quite frankly absurd number of joypad input combinations and a Masters degree in manual dexterity to execute them all! Farcical, imo.

If one or two button controllers are no longer the way to go, motion controllers seemingly becoming a fading obsession and the likes of Kinect not at all well suited to the genre I really don't know what the ideal solution is these days for playing footy games with... but it sure as hell isn't using eleventy billion different input command combinations on a normal joypad. All in my opinion, of course!
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Alberto 2K on August 14, 2013, 16:01:42 PM
I also miss instant fun, now is like DC says, you need to even see tutorials to get the hang of the games and learn several button combinations.

That means some days just learning how to play... In the 90s most of the games were pick and play, indie games are more similar to those games though. :)
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 14, 2013, 21:41:39 PM
Another thing I miss from the old days is this:

(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/OUTRUN-ATARI-ST-MINI-BOX-COMPLETE-WITH-AUDIO-TAPE-SOUNDTRACK-/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/z/LqsAAOxyD5pRJh-V/$T2eC16JHJF8E9nnC6VKFBRJh-VJHUw~~60_35.JPG)

When games like Xenophobe, Carrier Command and OutRun came with audio cassettes containing the soundtrack. Very cool indeed.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 14, 2013, 21:50:40 PM
Quote from: "The Laird"
Another thing I miss from the old days is this:

(http://i.ebayimg.com/t/OUTRUN-ATARI-ST-MINI-BOX-COMPLETE-WITH-AUDIO-TAPE-SOUNDTRACK-/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/z/LqsAAOxyD5pRJh-V/$T2eC16JHJF8E9nnC6VKFBRJh-VJHUw~~60_35.JPG)

When games like Xenophobe, Carrier Command and OutRun came with audio cassettes containing the soundtrack. Very cool indeed.

Starglider 2, 720 and Platoon were a few others that had tapes in with them that i can recal.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TL on August 14, 2013, 21:52:41 PM
Good call! I was trying to remember more of them, I had both 720 and Platoon I remember.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 14, 2013, 22:00:17 PM
Guess the 'Ultimate' in accompaning tapes has to go to:

Deus Ex Machina (ZX Spectrum/Mel Croucher).Tape contained a fully synchronised soundtrack, with music from Mel, along with narration by likes of Ian Dury, Jon Pertwee, Frankie Howerd etc....
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: guest4816 on August 14, 2013, 23:18:57 PM
Yay my first post. Hello world :)

I used to make a cuppa, put in my Speccy tape and while it was loading, read the instruction inlay and back story. Glancing up now and again to see if it had a cool loading screen.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Bobinator on August 14, 2013, 23:51:32 PM
You know what I miss? Manuals. Seriously, I miss the days when you could open up a game box on your way home, and read the manual so you'd have something to do. Nowadays, you get a little pamphlet that tells you how not to have a seizure, copyright junk, and a little thing that basically tells you to just play the game if you want to know how to play. Even something like Redneck Rampage, an FPS released not long after Duke Nukem 3D, basically made the manual into a fake tabloid. Sure, it wasn't much good as a manual, given how little it talked about the actual game, but the effort they put into it... what happened, man?
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: DreamcastRIP on August 15, 2013, 00:28:48 AM
Quote from: "Bobinator"
You know what I miss? Manuals. Seriously, I miss the days when you could open up a game box on your way home, and read the manual so you'd have something to do. Nowadays, you get a little pamphlet that tells you how not to have a seizure, copyright junk, and a little thing that basically tells you to just play the game if you want to know how to play. Even something like Redneck Rampage, an FPS released not long after Duke Nukem 3D, basically made the manual into a fake tabloid. Sure, it wasn't much good as a manual, given how little it talked about the actual game, but the effort they put into it... what happened, man?

Damn right!

The last EA disc-based game I purchased, FIFA 13, didn't even come supplied with a pamphlet, ffs! Just the disc inside an empty DVD case. Shocking. Gotta love how these companies hide behind the pretence of being 'environmentally friendly' when we all know they're being a bunch of penny pinching scrooges!

On a positive note, some current-gen games still come supplied with generous manuals. The standout example in my collection would The Witcher 2 Assassins of Kings Collectors Edition. That game comes supplied with,

* a card sleeve encasing the DVD case
* an 88 page Quest Handbook
* the OST audio CD
* a 38 page Game Manual
* a fold-out large size double sided full colour map

Plus it's a cracking game too (PC version) that cost me less than 10.  :1:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 15, 2013, 01:39:26 AM
Quote from: "Jonny Mutant"
Yay my first post. Hello world :)

I used to make a cuppa, put in my Speccy tape and while it was loading, read the instruction inlay and back story. Glancing up now and again to see if it had a cool loading screen.

:-) Standards slipping on here...seem's they'll let anyone in, i dunno (shakes head), anywho bloody good to (finally) see you on here...

You Speccy types think you had it tough? we A8 tape based gamers had time to drive to shops, buy tea, kettle, milk+sugar etc, put kettle on, then see BOOT ERROR just before game ran out of tape.....
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 15, 2013, 01:49:28 AM
Quote from: "Bobinator"
You know what I miss? Manuals. Seriously, I miss the days when you could open up a game box on your way home, and read the manual so you'd have something to do. Nowadays, you get a little pamphlet that tells you how not to have a seizure, copyright junk, and a little thing that basically tells you to just play the game if you want to know how to play. Even something like Redneck Rampage, an FPS released not long after Duke Nukem 3D, basically made the manual into a fake tabloid. Sure, it wasn't much good as a manual, given how little it talked about the actual game, but the effort they put into it... what happened, man?

And...what about Novella's in games like Starglider, Elite (Dark Wheel or something?), all gone.Microprose games..now they knew how to do manuals.....

I'd guess various factors 'happened': Cost reduction on printing costs, enviromental factors (look how green we are as a company, we've reduced our useage of paper by.....) etc, plus games seem to start with a training mission as std these days , along with a reward for following instructions...
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: TrekMD on August 16, 2013, 03:04:45 AM
I think this image sums things up fairly well (even it is a NES controller :3:)...

[align=center:3gewwxdb](https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-qrcGthNeVrM/Ug11gTdZFsI/AAAAAAAAA7A/V2S3uekPOpA/w600-h537-no/funny_demotivational_01.jpg)[/align:3gewwxdb]
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 16, 2013, 04:09:34 AM
Well....nobody deserves the moniker of Mr. Simple as do I when it comes to how I like my games, but
games like W3D, Doom and Quake series needed these extra controls. But outside of these, I can't think
of many others that are appealing. I believe that is because the one lasting beauty of the id games is that
though you had more controls, the games are still keep it simple stupid in game play. So though I dig a
joystick with a fire button more than not, there are a few games out there that the extra controller
buttons/ keys what have you are certainly useful and actually add to the experience.

Of course there are the Jag games like the Morph's, IS's, HS, BS and MC3D to mention a few. Those had
complex control schemes but they had game play to make it worth while, while still remaining reasonably
simple play elements.

Today you've got these games like Call of Duty, Halo and all those, that are amazing simulations but are
just too complex for me to consider them games. I don't need a 6 month boot camp training just to enjoy
software for my overly priced (what is supposed to be a) game system.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Rogue Trooper on August 16, 2013, 12:34:50 PM
Control schemes have ruined games like Tomb Raider (PS1), Darksiders (PS3), Command+Conq. (N64) and Metroid Prime (G.C) and hampered my enjoyment of Alien Res.PS1.

If i'm wrestling just to aim, walk in a straight line, lock on to a bosses weak points or what ever, i'm not going to be sat there thinking that i'm going to be spending hours getting more and more pissed off, rather than see everything game has to offer.

So developers, what happens is, i turn game off, put in another, never buy a sequel from you etc, so your loosing sales by not getting the basics right.
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Gorf on August 17, 2013, 03:35:08 AM
Quote from: "Rogue Trooper"
Control schemes have ruined games like Tomb Raider (PS1), Darksiders (PS3), Command+Conq. (N64) and Metroid Prime (G.C) and hampered my enjoyment of Alien Res.PS1.

If i'm wrestling just to aim, walk in a straight line, lock on to a bosses weak points or what ever, i'm not going to be sat there thinking that i'm going to be spending hours getting more and more pissed off, rather than see everything game has to offer.

So developers, what happens is, i turn game off, put in another, never buy a sequel from you etc, so your loosing sales by not getting the basics right.

For some reason, I think a lot of developers equate complex controls with fun game.
[size=240]BZZZZZT! Sorry, but that answer is incorrect![/size]
Make the bloody friggin game fun for crying out loud! Don't make me have to think
too hard for goodness sake. I can do that crap at work you bloody A-HOLES!!!! Sheesh!!!!

Whew....ok....I feel a little better now.  :35:
Title: Re: What do you miss from classic gaming?
Post by: Bobinator on August 17, 2013, 04:49:57 AM
I think the last time I played a game where the controls were just so complicated I couldn't be bothered to play it anymore was Grand Theft Auto 4. It didn't help that GTA4 was boring as shit. I put about a half hour into it, turned the game off, and never looked back.

I have the same issue with most flight simulators, even stuff like Wing Commander. You basically CAN'T play those sorts of games on a keyboard, or else you'll have to cram over the quick reference card like you're studying for a frickin' final exam.